I'd really like to find an option which can preferably be version controlled and doesn't require hard-to-remember schema (ex. plantUML).
At work it's always tough to find something which works, and which is free or already licensed (no chance to get new licenses), and which is easy enough for teammates of varying technical abilities to contribute to.
For Arch Diagrams, most people seem to jump to Draw.IO, which is nice, but I'm not sure how easily it can be version controlled (although I haven't tried). At work it usually falls into the "did you put your latest version on SharePoint" black-hole (we don't pay for the cloud syncing version of draw.io). I wanted to try Figma, since it's at least a bit more collaborative, but there aren't any good first-party templates, so maybe it's not the right place, either.
For DFDs, I'd like to try Mermaid, or D2, or PlantUML (scared by the syntax on that one, though). I've not tried any of these, right now we usually do these in draw.io too, but I feel like code-defined ones would be an easier to maintain option and can live in a repo easier.
Sequence Diagrams are currently usually done using the sequencediagram.org engine, which I'm not a huge fan of, but at least it's relatively easily handled text. I don't think there was a good VS Code integration last time I checked (I think it was some web emulator, not a built-in engine?).
ERDs, I'd also like to find a good local tool to probably just use SQL on the backend, so that it's one less conversion. I'm open to all suggestions for that, though.
I've been doing diagrams with Mermaid. The beauty is that I use Gemini to ask it to add stuff to the diagram. And there are a bunch of plug-ins for Google docs to visualize the diagrams. I just wish Confluence had a free way to do it.
tldraw is also something very easy to use but surprisingly powerful and I know they are compared a lot to Excalidraw, not so sure about draw.io - but could be worth adding to your list. It is a very extendable library with some fun genai hooks like makereal.tldraw
I just thought the same and thought this was really some dark pattern not adding any trust. Also there is no really good examples or performance metrics.
There is stuff on GitHub that actually does similar stuff [0] [1] . We tried some pipelines a year ago for a project (understanding compliance relevant process diagrams) and it was still quite a challenge . Wonder what the state is now with all those vision llms and even if commercial how good that stuff is.
They should have let us tried the tool without signing in, that is only natural. Why would I give you my time and my personal information because you claim you do something? It is deceptive and unfair to our time to ask me to sign in as the final step. Instantly closed. The new generation of developers should learn some manners.
There’s also a “include a copy of my diagram” feature when exporting an image from drawio, which partially overlaps with the use case of this app (assuming the export in question was done with this feature enabled).
Youtube videos that are lectures with slide shows .. or PDF slide decks ..can also be a input / starting point..with some additional detection and parsing. Both can have multiple images in them.
This is a very well done site but perhaps a bit too much of a demand test to be on HN which is extremely tech heavy (the typical reader is likely to wonder "I can already ask an LLM to do this. Why would I pay this company to do this for me?"). This would do very well on other, less tech heavy sites. I would also suggest some changes.
Above the fold, there's a lot of pitch how Draw.io requires "No credit card, no trial periods, no BS." and "It's genuinely free - has been for years, always will be. That's why millions use it, and why converting your images to Draw.io format makes so much sense. Your converted files will always be editable, no subscription required"
Below the fold and at the very bottom, this service itself starts off at $5/mo on sale right now.
I would imagine this would confuse people. They might interpret that this service is free too, then be suprised at the "no free tier" and some are going to be outright angry and very vocal about it.
So I would change the messaging along the lines of "We help you convert images into Draw.io so you pay us just once for the diagram you want converted"
To enhance the message, I would further say "This is how much we sponsor Draw.io for enabling our own business" and write blog posts about the struggles to build the service or even open source the methods to fine-tune a model to do the conversion.
I really like draw.io, I've used it for a number of things including wireframing an app and creating cheatsheets for things.
It's definitely not as frictionless as excalidraw though. Excalidraw, whilst not as powerful as draw.io has the interface down correctly.
What do people use for creating artifacts at their jobs?
Architecture diagrams, data flow diagrams, sequence diagrams, network diagrams, entity-relationship diagrams ...
I'd really like to find an option which can preferably be version controlled and doesn't require hard-to-remember schema (ex. plantUML).
At work it's always tough to find something which works, and which is free or already licensed (no chance to get new licenses), and which is easy enough for teammates of varying technical abilities to contribute to.
For Arch Diagrams, most people seem to jump to Draw.IO, which is nice, but I'm not sure how easily it can be version controlled (although I haven't tried). At work it usually falls into the "did you put your latest version on SharePoint" black-hole (we don't pay for the cloud syncing version of draw.io). I wanted to try Figma, since it's at least a bit more collaborative, but there aren't any good first-party templates, so maybe it's not the right place, either.
For DFDs, I'd like to try Mermaid, or D2, or PlantUML (scared by the syntax on that one, though). I've not tried any of these, right now we usually do these in draw.io too, but I feel like code-defined ones would be an easier to maintain option and can live in a repo easier.
Sequence Diagrams are currently usually done using the sequencediagram.org engine, which I'm not a huge fan of, but at least it's relatively easily handled text. I don't think there was a good VS Code integration last time I checked (I think it was some web emulator, not a built-in engine?).
ERDs, I'd also like to find a good local tool to probably just use SQL on the backend, so that it's one less conversion. I'm open to all suggestions for that, though.
I've been doing diagrams with Mermaid. The beauty is that I use Gemini to ask it to add stuff to the diagram. And there are a bunch of plug-ins for Google docs to visualize the diagrams. I just wish Confluence had a free way to do it.
tldraw is also something very easy to use but surprisingly powerful and I know they are compared a lot to Excalidraw, not so sure about draw.io - but could be worth adding to your list. It is a very extendable library with some fun genai hooks like makereal.tldraw
Once signed up and wanted to test once says no credits so this post is really just an advert
This is a paid service but the website wording piggybacks on Draw.io to imply it's a free service, I'd avoid it as it comes across as very underhand.
"It's that free diagramming tool that just works. No credit card, no trial periods, no BS", etc
I just thought the same and thought this was really some dark pattern not adding any trust. Also there is no really good examples or performance metrics.
There is stuff on GitHub that actually does similar stuff [0] [1] . We tried some pipelines a year ago for a project (understanding compliance relevant process diagrams) and it was still quite a challenge . Wonder what the state is now with all those vision llms and even if commercial how good that stuff is.
[0] https://github.com/Zackriya-Solutions/diagram2graph
[1] https://github.com/modhtom/Pic2Chart
"sign in to convert" ... sigh
They need to make money - should the have open sourced the tool?
They should have let us tried the tool without signing in, that is only natural. Why would I give you my time and my personal information because you claim you do something? It is deceptive and unfair to our time to ask me to sign in as the final step. Instantly closed. The new generation of developers should learn some manners.
These multi modal LLMs are too expensive to run for that
Are you saying they want to reduce the number of people trying it out with friction?
Yup. Same. Requiring my information is a non-starter. No matter how good your product is I won't sign in just to try it out.
They are utilitarians, they do not care about manners.
I agree with your main point.
Why are extremes the only option here.
There’s also a “include a copy of my diagram” feature when exporting an image from drawio, which partially overlaps with the use case of this app (assuming the export in question was done with this feature enabled).
Suggestion for an add-on feature ...
Youtube videos that are lectures with slide shows .. or PDF slide decks ..can also be a input / starting point..with some additional detection and parsing. Both can have multiple images in them.
LLMs work great with mermaid
Weird choice that you can't even see an example of the image->draw.io conversion without creating an account
I thought so too...
deceiving.
This is a very well done site but perhaps a bit too much of a demand test to be on HN which is extremely tech heavy (the typical reader is likely to wonder "I can already ask an LLM to do this. Why would I pay this company to do this for me?"). This would do very well on other, less tech heavy sites. I would also suggest some changes.
Above the fold, there's a lot of pitch how Draw.io requires "No credit card, no trial periods, no BS." and "It's genuinely free - has been for years, always will be. That's why millions use it, and why converting your images to Draw.io format makes so much sense. Your converted files will always be editable, no subscription required"
Below the fold and at the very bottom, this service itself starts off at $5/mo on sale right now.
I would imagine this would confuse people. They might interpret that this service is free too, then be suprised at the "no free tier" and some are going to be outright angry and very vocal about it.
So I would change the messaging along the lines of "We help you convert images into Draw.io so you pay us just once for the diagram you want converted"
To enhance the message, I would further say "This is how much we sponsor Draw.io for enabling our own business" and write blog posts about the struggles to build the service or even open source the methods to fine-tune a model to do the conversion.
Good luck, this is valuable!
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