Tim Gowers: What sort of maths are LLMs good at?

(gowers.wordpress.com)

56 points | by ColinWright an hour ago ago

6 comments

  • n4r9 35 minutes ago ago

    A thoughtful and measured post, as usual from Gowers. The final note is neat and worth pasting out here in full:

    > A good sign that LLMs have reached human level for a much wider class of problems will be if they start proving theorems using methods that, like much of the very best human mathematics, are new and surprising but that with hindsight come to seem beautiful and natural. They should also be methods that are difficult to stumble on by accident. It is hard to say precisely what would count as such a proof, but I think we’ll recognise it when we see it.

    • tcp_handshaker 10 minutes ago ago

      >>A good sign that LLMs have reached human level for a much wider class >> of problems will be if they start proving theorems using methods that, like much of the very best human mathematics, are new and surprising but that with hindsight come to seem beautiful and natural.

      I must be taking crazy pills and the AGI surely will pass me by... But TODAY, middle August 2026...And in the context of testing and evaluating the capabilities of current SOTA models to implement an Agentic application for job search, here is some simple inhouse built evals I run today, since I don´t trust LLM vendors published benchmarks...

      Models tested: GPT-5.6 Sol in Extra High mode and Opus 4.8 Max.

      TASK REQUEST: Clear, not too long not too short prompt, for LLMs to go out and research freelance consulting gigs for one specific IT domain, and in one specific country in Europe, including maybe opportunities driven from temp agencies based in geographically close countries.

      RESULT: Models go out, fetch the data, and completely misunderstand the task...offering on first results, permanent roles instead of freelance, and based on the country where the agencies are, not in the one it was request for. Think for example IT jobs in Ireland, while freelance agency in London.

      ANALYSIS: No intelligence I can call it shown by models, adding cognitive effort for human in the loop to detect subtle factors, and therefore totally useless for agentic app...Best practices would be I guess to add agents on top of agents but although in the p95 of cases that will reduce the errors...for the remaining 5% that could have hallucinations or logic hallucinations like these ones, compounding on top of other logic hallucinations.

      I dont care about the theorems being proven. At the end we will found out what most mathematicians were doing, was just exploring the same combinatorial and abstraction patterns. And because of that I am sure LLMs will make mince meat of a lot of mathematical domains.

      But right now, what we call intelligence is not existing where it matters, and Ed Zitron is right its a parlour trick.

      • m348e912 4 minutes ago ago

        >TASK REQUEST: Clear, not too long not too short prompt, for LLMs to go out and research freelance consulting gigs for one specific IT domain, and in one specific country in Europe, including maybe opportunities driven from temp agencies based in geographically close countries.

        As a human, not an LLM, I could interpret "including maybe opportunities driven from temp agencies based in geographically close countries" as meaning "including opportunities in nearby countries outside of Ireland" (that happen to be driven by temp agencies).

        Before writing off LLM as simply a "stochastic parrot" or a "parlour trick" remember it can't read your mind, not yet anyway.

        • tcp_handshaker 2 minutes ago ago

          I am describing the contents of the prompt that was not the prompt.

  • h_mirin 7 minutes ago ago

    This is really an argument about test-time scaling, even though the post never uses the term.

    These days "test-time scaling" mostly means letting the model talk to itself for longer, but the first genuinely surprising results came from plain sampling. Google's AlphaCode generated millions of candidate programs and filtered them down to a handful of submissions, which beat the average human programmer in 2022, before ChatGPT even showed up.

    Sampling is what AI is good at. Making examples and doing LeetCode are similar in that verification is clear and cheap. Compared to that, "proof" is still a vague concept, except where Lean works. See the fuss over the ABC conjecture. So humans are still needed.

    The interesting question to me is what happens after enough learning from "sampling." Isn't AlphaGo's move 37 an AI's nose? If that happens in mathematics, we may end up with results that are correct, machine checkable, and not explainable in any way we find satisfying.

  • pinkmoonx 22 minutes ago ago

    How interesting is it that in the same way the human brain unconsciously does calculus and linear algebra, but struggles in the conscious space (we have to go learn it, it’s not easy) the same is true of LLMs.

    They are algebra, and yet kinda suck at it without training